Combatting Cult Mind Control

Discuss your thoughts on books you have read.

Re: Combatting Cult Mind Control

Postby Marcus » Fri May 22, 2009 1:33 pm

leavingwt wrote:
Marcus wrote:I'm amazed that more people don't put this information together and figure it out for themselves.


Marcus,

Have you read Hassan's book?

-LWT


I never read the book, I just pieced most of this stuff together privately.

It might be nice to have it all together in a book though, must look into getting a copy. Critical Thinker, thanks so much for the posts, they've been very useful as a collection for referencing some of the things I had reservations on.
"Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth"
"It is not death that a man should fear, but he should fear never beginning to live"
- Marcus Aurelius
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Re: Combatting Cult Mind Control

Postby leavingwt » Fri May 22, 2009 1:45 pm

The reason I asked, is because the book explains exactly why 99.9% don't figure it out.
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Re: Combatting Cult Mind Control

Postby RedMax » Fri May 22, 2009 3:57 pm

Jezebel wrote:Oh sure, just think of all of the preaching opportunities you cold have if you were homeless, living on the streets because you had no skills in which to be employed in our terrible economy where people with advanced degrees cannot find or stay in a job and have lost their homes. But, if you were homeless, you could preach to others at homeless shelters, soup kitchens and such. ....
Maybe a little bitter, I know.

Don't forget this is the best way of life! Being poor, walking around telling others to sell everything and be poor to ... and on and on... So that one day you can die an old man and be a King with Jesus.
These delusions began centuries ago, at least we're doing our part to end the cycle.
The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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Not only is the universe stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine.
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Re: Combatting Cult Mind Control

Postby leavingwt » Sun May 24, 2009 11:28 am

bttt
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Re: Combatting Cult Mind Control

Postby Critical Thinker » Wed May 27, 2009 11:17 am

pg. 82, "Problems are always the fault of the member, and are due to his weak faith, his lack of understanding."


*** w98 5/15 p. 19 par. 14 The Quality of Your Faith—Tested Now ***
But some who became Christians in the past have since then allowed themselves to be fashioned after this system of things. They have not resisted the spirit of the world. (2 Peter 2:20-22) Worldly distractions have absorbed their interest and time, thus impeding their progress. Instead of keeping their minds and hearts fixed firmly on God’s Kingdom and his righteousness, putting such first in life, they have turned aside to pursue materialistic goals. Unless they are moved to acknowledge their weak faith and lukewarm state and to change their course by seeking divine counsel, they are in danger of losing their precious relationship with Jehovah and his organization.—Revelation 3:15-19.

*** w06 7/15 p. 22 par. 14 Focus on the Goodness of Jehovah’s Organization ***
14 In modern times, a very small number among God’s people have become disgruntled with some aspect of Christian teaching and have murmured against the earthly part of Jehovah’s organization. Why does this happen? Such murmuring is often caused by a lack of understanding of God’s way of doing things. The Creator progressively reveals the truth to his people. Hence, our understanding of the Scriptures is bound to be refined from time to time. The vast majority of Jehovah’s people rejoice over such refinements. A few become “righteous overmuch” and resent the changes. (Ecclesiastes 7:16) Pride may play a role, and some fall into the trap of independent thinking. Whatever the reason, such murmuring is hazardous, since it can draw us back into the world and its ways.
I was told a lot of things, too. That I was chosen, that I was special. I end up with a tumor on my spine and my daughter's blood all over my hands. -Benjamin Linus

Don't give up your education, your hopes and ambitions, to follow a rainbow.-Jeanne Mills
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Re: Combatting Cult Mind Control

Postby Critical Thinker » Thu May 28, 2009 7:10 am

pg. 69, "Repetition, monotony, rhythm: these are the lulling, hypnotic cadences in which the formal indoctrination is generally delievered. Material is repeated over and over and over. If the lectureres are sophisticated, they vary their talks somewhat in an attempt to hold interest, but the message is the same every time.

*** km 12/99 p. 1 pars. 2-5 Haven’t We Heard That Before? ***
2 In our time Jehovah’s organization has arranged for important subjects to be reviewed over and over again at congregation meetings. Certain publications have been studied repeatedly. Yes, it is important to hear things that we have heard before!
3 Repetition Fills a Vital Need: Jehovah’s reminders deepen our understanding, expand our viewpoint, and strengthen our determination to stay on course spiritually. (Ps. 119:129) Reviewing God’s standards and principles is like looking in a mirror. It helps us scrutinize ourselves and counteracts the tendency to be “a forgetful hearer.”—Jas. 1:22-25.
4 If we do not keep reminding ourselves of the truth, other things will influence our hearts. God’s reminders strengthen us to resist the corrupting influences of Satan’s world. (Ps. 119:2, 3, 99, 133; Phil. 3:1) The regular reminders we receive regarding the fulfillment of God’s purposes prompt us to “keep on the watch.” (Mark 13:32-37) Repetition of Scriptural truths helps us remain on the road to everlasting life.—Ps. 119:144.
5 How to Benefit Personally: We must ‘incline our hearts to God’s reminders.’ (Ps. 119:36) When a familiar subject is to be considered at a congregation meeting, we should prepare in advance, look up the cited scriptures, and reflect on how we can apply the information. Let us not skip the written review in the Theocratic Ministry School, thinking that it is not needed. (Luke 8:18) Never would we want to become inattentive because basic truths are often repeated at our meetings.—Heb. 5:11.

*** w95 7/15 pp. 21-22 You Can Break Through These Barriers! ***
Certain information presented at the meetings may be somewhat repetitive. Necessarily so! All of God’s servants need reminders. The imperfect flesh, with its wayward leanings and faulty memory, needs all the help it can get. The apostle Peter ‘was disposed to remind fellow believers of some things, although they knew them and were firmly set in the truth.’ (2 Peter 1:12) Jesus also explained that “every public instructor . . . is like a man, a householder, who brings out of his treasure store things new and old.” (Matthew 13:52) Thus, while our meetings bring out familiar Scriptural thoughts, or ‘old treasures,’ there are always some ‘new treasures’ to delight us.

*** be study 21 p. 152 par. 2 Scriptures Read With Proper Emphasis ***
Repetition. You can place emphasis on a particular point by interrupting yourself and rereading the word or phrase. A method that is often preferable is to complete the text and then repeat the key expression.

*** be study 35 p. 206 - p. 208 Repetition for Emphasis ***
Study 35
Repetition for Emphasis
What do you need to do?
State more than once the points that you especially want your audience to remember.
Why is it important?
In addition to being a memory aid, repetition can be used effectively to highlight principal ideas and help your audience to understand them clearly.
EFFECTIVE teaching includes the use of repetition. When an important point is stated more than once, those in attendance are more likely to remember it. If the idea is restated in a slightly different way, they may even be able to understand it more clearly.
If your listeners do not remember what you say, your words will not influence what they believe or how they live. They will probably continue thinking about points to which you give special emphasis.
Jehovah, our Grand Instructor, sets the pattern for us in his use of repetition. He gave the Ten Commandments to the nation of Israel. Through an angelic spokesman, he caused the nation to hear those commandments at Mount Sinai. Later he gave them to Moses in written form. (Ex. 20:1-17; 31:18; Deut. 5:22) At Jehovah’s direction, Moses restated those commandments to the nation before they entered the Promised Land, and by means of holy spirit, Moses made a record of that, as found at Deuteronomy 5:6-21. Among the commandments given to Israel was the requirement that they love and serve Jehovah with their whole heart, soul, and vital force. This too was stated again and again. (Deut. 6:5; 10:12; 11:13; 30:6) Why? Because, as Jesus said, it was “the greatest and first commandment.” (Matt. 22:34-38) Through the prophet Jeremiah, Jehovah reminded the people of Judah more than 20 times about the seriousness of obeying him in all the things that he commanded them. (Jer. 7:23; 11:4; 12:17; 19:15) And through Ezekiel, God stated more than 60 times that the nations “will have to know that I am Jehovah.”—Ezek. 6:10; 38:23.
In the record of the ministry of Jesus, we also observe effective use of repetition. There are, for example, the four Gospels—each one covering important events that are reported in one or more of the other Gospels but viewing these events from slightly different angles. In his own teaching, Jesus covered the same basic point of instruction on more than one occasion but in different ways. (Mark 9:34-37; 10:35-45; John 13:2-17) And while on the Mount of Olives a few days before his death, Jesus used repetition to emphasize this vital counsel: “Keep on the watch, . . . because you do not know on what day your Lord is coming.”—Matt. 24:42; 25:13.
In the Field Ministry. When you witness to people, you hope that they will remember what you say. Effective use of repetition can help to achieve that goal.
Frequently, repetition at the time a matter is being discussed will help impress it on a person’s mind. Thus, after reading a scripture, you could emphasize it by pointing to a key portion of it and asking, “Did you notice how that text is worded?”
The final sentences in a conversation can also be used effectively. For example, you might say: “The main point that I hope you will remember from our conversation is . . .” Then restate it simply. It might be something like this: “God’s purpose is that the earth be transformed into a paradise. That purpose is sure to be realized.” Or possibly: “The Bible clearly shows that we are living in the last days of this system of things. If we are going to survive its end, we need to learn what God requires of us.” Or it could be: “As we have seen, the Bible offers practical counsel on how to cope with problems of family life.” In some cases you may simply repeat a quotation from the Bible as the point to be remembered. Of course, doing this effectively requires forethought.
On return visits, including Bible studies, your use of repetition may involve review questions.
When a person finds it difficult to understand or to apply Bible counsel, you may need to bring the subject up on more than one occasion. Endeavor to approach it from various angles. The discussions do not have to be lengthy but should encourage the student to keep thinking about the matter. Remember, Jesus used this sort of repetition in helping his disciples overcome the desire to be in first place.—Matt. 18:1-6; 20:20-28; Luke 22:24-27.
When Giving Discourses. If you give talks from the platform, your objective is not merely to present information. You want the audience to understand it, to remember it, and to apply it. To achieve that, make good use of repetition.
If you repeat the main points too often, however, you may lose the attention of your audience. Carefully select points that deserve special emphasis. These usually are the main points around which your talk is developed, but they may also include other thoughts that will be of special value to your audience.
To make use of repetition, you might first outline your main points in the introduction. Do that with short statements that provide a broad overview of what you will cover, with questions, or with brief examples that pose problems to be resolved. You might state how many main points there are and list them by number. Then develop each of those points in the body of your talk. Emphasis can be reinforced in the body of your talk by restating each main point before going on to the next one. Or it can be accomplished by using an example that involves application of the main point. Further emphasis can be given to your main points by using a conclusion that restates them, highlights them by using contrasts, answers the questions that were raised, or briefly sets out solutions to the problems that were posed.
In addition to the above, an experienced speaker observes carefully the individuals who make up his audience. If some of them find a certain idea difficult to grasp, the speaker is aware of it. If the point is important, he covers it again. However, repeating the same words may not accomplish his purpose. There is more to teaching than that. He must be adaptable. He may need to make impromptu additions to his talk. Your learning to cope with the needs of the audience in this way will determine to a great extent your effectiveness as a teacher.
WHEN TO DO IT
Immediately after stating an important point or after fully developing a main idea.
At the conclusion of your conversation or your discourse.
When you discern that your listeners are finding it difficult to grasp some key point.
More than once, possibly days or weeks apart in the case of return visits and Bible studies.
EXERCISES: (1) As you end a conversation with someone you met for the first time in the field ministry, repeat just one important point that you discussed and that you want the person to remember. (2) As you conclude a return visit, state again one or two key points for the interested person to remember from your discussion.
I was told a lot of things, too. That I was chosen, that I was special. I end up with a tumor on my spine and my daughter's blood all over my hands. -Benjamin Linus

Don't give up your education, your hopes and ambitions, to follow a rainbow.-Jeanne Mills
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Re: Combatting Cult Mind Control

Postby minnie » Wed Jun 17, 2009 1:48 pm

my study conductor said to me once when i brought up the cult thing that 'how can the JW's be a cult? cults are easy to get into and hard to get out of...whereas the congregation is hard to get into but easy to get out of!'
What do others make of this comment?
"Your time is limited,so dont waste it living someone elses life.Dont be trapped by Dogma-which is living with the results of other peoples thinking." “You are the embodiment of the information you choose to accept and act upon."
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Re: Combatting Cult Mind Control

Postby Rifter » Wed Jun 17, 2009 1:51 pm

minnie wrote:my study conductor said to me once when i brought up the cult thing that 'how can the JW's be a cult? cults are easy to get into and hard to get out of...whereas the congregation is hard to get into but easy to get out of!'
What do others make of this comment?


He's delusional. JW's need to think comforting thoughts such as this, which are blatantly contrary to actual WT practices, in order to "prove" to themselves that they are doing the right thing. If he really believes that then he should try leaving and watch what happens to his family and social circle.
The universe seems neither benign nor hostile, merely indifferent. - Carl Sagan
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Re: Combatting Cult Mind Control

Postby net1261 » Wed Jun 17, 2009 1:55 pm

Wow, your comments are like word for word from WT to that book.
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Re: Combatting Cult Mind Control

Postby minnie » Wed Jun 17, 2009 1:58 pm

Rifter wrote:
minnie wrote:my study conductor said to me once when i brought up the cult thing that 'how can the JW's be a cult? cults are easy to get into and hard to get out of...whereas the congregation is hard to get into but easy to get out of!'
What do others make of this comment?


He's delusional. JW's need to think comforting thoughts such as this, which are blatantly contrary to actual WT practices, in order to "prove" to themselves that they are doing the right thing. If he really believes that then he should try leaving and watch what happens to his family and social circle.


what a great answer! why didnt i think to say that about the family/social circle thing?! d'oh :D
"Your time is limited,so dont waste it living someone elses life.Dont be trapped by Dogma-which is living with the results of other peoples thinking." “You are the embodiment of the information you choose to accept and act upon."
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